Not going anywhere

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lonewolf
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Re: Not going anywhere

Post by lonewolf » February 3rd, 2019, 4:15 pm

LoneAlpha14 wrote:
February 3rd, 2019, 7:56 am
Welcome to the community! We have similar usernames! :)

I think we should be more positive overall. I was quite down due to many of the things you've mentioned, but once you realize a number of things, everything becomes better. Yes, I doubt, wonder, and question all the time. Yet, it is by acting that our fears and everything that's torturing us begins to fade away as we learn to exist despite our being so aware and observant. The solution isn't to feel depressed or act as a pessimist would, but to remain strong and persistent - as you go, you discover, and things unfold.

I agree this society is a pure and ridiculous mess of fads and personal gains and whatnots. On the other hand, everything lies within ourselves. It's how you choose to behave and feel that will reflect you in the society. You don't need to fit in, but running away isn't a solution either. (Not saying you are, I'm writing in general.)

We all have a mission. It might be as revolutionary as an invention, or as simple as baking cakes for people we love to make them happy. Yet, our personality isn't really satisfied with pure existence, but if you keep seeking and asking without doing anything, you will remain in the same place, which will pull you even further down.

If you want to make the rest of your life better, tell me, what is that makes you feel alive? (Do note that I haven't read the previous messages because I didn't want my writing to be influenced unconsciously by something I would have read.)

I don't want to be "positive" or "negative". These are only idealizations that ignore the nature of reality, so I'd rather be realist.

"Acting" did nothing for me in the last 5 years. I went by "automatic pilot" until I was 22 and, since them, I've been trying to "act", but this just doesn't work at all. I'm not going anywhere. When you don't know where you want to go, all the paths are the wrong one.

I don't believe in the concept of "mission". I'm not satisfied with pure existence, but I've been unable to go beyond that.

Nothing makes me feel "alive". I never felt like that.
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LoneAlpha14
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Re: Not going anywhere

Post by LoneAlpha14 » February 4th, 2019, 6:23 am

@lonewolf, I understand. I actually was the same until a while, when I lived through something and realized many things, one of which was we needed to get out to feel alive. That despite the fact I might not have been "alive" all the time back then.

Being realistic is still part of me. But, do you really think seeing a picture clearly but from a more positive angle is idealization? I mean, I'm not talking about those freaks living in clouds, escaping reality! I'm talking about one's reactions and attitudes. Wouldn't say that positivism and realism are mutually exclusive in this case.

"all the paths are the wrong one" - I will be direct and say that this is rather pessimistic. Why don't you say "all the paths are an option", "a potential opportunity"? You talk about being realistic and refuting any kinds of idealization (which is good, we should stand firmly on the ground), but you have still chosen a side - in this case, the one that's less beneficial for you. You stand in a place saying you don't know where to go and how to live, but how do you mean to find out? By saying you don't know, and thinking nothing's the right direction, how do you expect to be able to see the one when it comes? Trust me when I say - I've been there, for years! And I still somewhat am. But I am exploring, I know what are some and want to discover more fields that would fulfill me.

What do you believe in? How do you define "mission" in the first place? What have you done to go beyond?

(FYI, I felt really alive only a few times in my life, some of which occurred when I got out of my comfort zone. I think it's harder for us to feel alive when we're aware of everything; yet, not impossible, and definitely not an excuse not to try to!)
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lonewolf
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Re: Not going anywhere

Post by lonewolf » February 4th, 2019, 6:27 pm

LoneAlpha14 wrote:
February 4th, 2019, 6:23 am
I understand. I actually was the same until a while, when I lived through something and realized many things, one of which was we needed to get out to feel alive. That despite the fact I might not have been "alive" all the time back then.

Being realistic is still part of me. But, do you really think seeing a picture clearly but from a more positive angle is idealization? I mean, I'm not talking about those freaks living in clouds, escaping reality! I'm talking about one's reactions and attitudes. Wouldn't say that positivism and realism are mutually exclusive in this case.

"all the paths are the wrong one" - I will be direct and say that this is rather pessimistic. Why don't you say "all the paths are an option", "a potential opportunity"? You talk about being realistic and refuting any kinds of idealization (which is good, we should stand firmly on the ground), but you have still chosen a side - in this case, the one that's less beneficial for you. You stand in a place saying you don't know where to go and how to live, but how do you mean to find out? By saying you don't know, and thinking nothing's the right direction, how do you expect to be able to see the one when it comes? Trust me when I say - I've been there, for years! And I still somewhat am. But I am exploring, I know what are some and want to discover more fields that would fulfill me.

What do you believe in? How do you define "mission" in the first place? What have you done to go beyond?

(FYI, I felt really alive only a few times in my life, some of which occurred when I got out of my comfort zone. I think it's harder for us to feel alive when we're aware of everything; yet, not impossible, and definitely not an excuse not to try to!)
I just want to deal with self-evident things. For me thinking "positive" or "negative" are ways that people use to stay away from reality and avoid to face it. Being positive or negative is to neglect the contraditory nature of reality. I still stand by that: "positive" or "negative" are just forms of wishful thinking.

"All the paths are the wrong one" x "All the paths are an option": This is a thing related with my life until now. I didn't "choose a side", because I never had the opportunity to choose anything. Like I said before, real things are self-evident. When you find out something that really "is", it just comes to you naturally. I've been trying things everyday and all the time. Never found anything until now. So, "the one" hasn't been found out.

"What do you believe in?": This question is too broad, be more specific.

"Mission" entails predestination, so I don't believe in it.

"What have you done to go beyond?": Again, too broad of a question. Be more specific.

I would like to talk to you in another platform if possible.
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GMSI7D
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Re: Not going anywhere

Post by GMSI7D » February 4th, 2019, 7:01 pm


mission entails understanding, not predestination



for example, you have access to knowledge that nobody has

your moral duty is to act on it because nobody will do it . you are the leader not the crowd

this is your mission

this is not " predestination or fate "



please , stand above the crowd for a second and use your head

don't be like everyone else or why are you here ?



i am here to read people who think, not the crowd .


.
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lonewolf
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Re: Not going anywhere

Post by lonewolf » February 5th, 2019, 12:18 am

GMSI7D wrote:
February 4th, 2019, 7:01 pm
Mission entails understanding, not predestination.
For example, you have access to knowledge that nobody has.
Your moral duty is to act on it because nobody will do it. You are the leader not the crowd.
This is your mission.
This is not "predestination or fate".
Please, stand above the crowd for a second and use your head.
Don't be like everyone else or why are you here?
I am here to read people who think, not the crowd .
I'm very disheartened and unmotivated at the moment. I don't believe in "mission", "moral duty" or any of the "social engineering" babble that you are trying to inject here at the forum. I'm not a "master" or anything like that. I'm just someone who thought before that I had a special gift (my supposed "intelligence") and now it looks like what I know is of no use at all.

I think, I'm not part of the crowd, even if I wanted to do that. I just think that my life in particular is useless.

So, if you want to "wake up" my "potential", I ask you to give me real arguments instead of repeating platitudes like "mission". You are always asking for everybody here at the forum to establish a "superior" place of discussion, so I want you to get that opportunity and show that your worldview could be useful to bring an INTJ out of his existencial depression.

I'm an INTJ without a goal or mission. I'm feeling like life isn't worth of living. I'm starting to think that knowledge, intelligence and understanding of the big picture have been making more bad than good for my mental health. Please, convince me that the person that I am can make me live a worthy life.

I don't want money, fame, fortune, sex, etc. I wanted my life to be more enjoyable than what it is at the moment. But I feel like my knowledge is more of a burden than a gift. I'm almost giving up on the intellectual life. If you could help me to believe on that again, I would be very grateful for that.

I would like to talk with you on another platform if possible.
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LoneAlpha14
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Re: Not going anywhere

Post by LoneAlpha14 » February 5th, 2019, 7:26 am

@lonewolf, again, if you reject positive and negative attitudes, why have you chosen such a negative one? You opted for it! You are just doing what most of the people are - curling up close to the darkness. I am sorry, it's not that I cannot replicate some of the things you said, because I also felt and thought more or less similarly at some point, and I have this natural ability to grasp and understand people objectively, but refusing to change one's opinion and attitude due to some preconceived conceptions won't get us anywhere. Why do you think being positive means escaping reality? Why would a mission imply predestination, and so what if it does? What's so bad about predestination if you still are yet to discover it? What's preset there in your mind? Maybe in some outer universe, but here? Nothing. And, sometimes, life's more about our path on our mission (if I need to use the word), rather than the "mission" itself. And that path is untamed, unexplored, and full of mystery.

My questions were referring to what you first said - I wanted to know whether you've even tried to discover more; you said you did, and nothing fulfilled you. It's okay, it happens - I know. But, you just need to keep moving! What makes you feel alive? What awakens even a bit of emotions within yourself? What did you thought your special gift? What happened that made you start feel there's nothing life has in store for you? What made you change your attitude? If it's just out of pure realization, you belong back in the era of romanticism. You know why? Because they were mostly the ones to cry over their poor destinies. About a life of unexperienced, unmet emotions, adventures, and all the rest. Once again, sorry for my being so blunt and brutal, but I think it's too bad for a potential talent to rot in such a whirlwind of demons created by the very same person. I know it's daunting, because I am still managing on getting out myself. But I made so much progress totally on my own, that I want to convince others they are the ones to design their life, and make choices that would impact their being. Not the society. Screw the society. You don't have to belong to be able to live, progress, and contribute. Or whatever. I guess I should stop, because, after all, you don't know my story, and I don't know yours. But, let's keep it here, since it is a community of us, who came to understand and discover, and, hopefully, eventually help and improve. Simply, learn, realize, and progress.. Too many verbs, pick yours. :)
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GMSI7D
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Re: Not going anywhere

Post by GMSI7D » February 5th, 2019, 10:43 am

on this forum, people are " lone wolves " and things like that.

this is ok for a while because society is stupid as Bob Fischer ( chess world champion ) said

but on the long term, you have to think above that.


the point is not to be the caveman in the woods but a leader of men above the stupid crowd


so it looks like this on the balance :



stupid crowd < ----------> you here leading a small group of men ( not the stupid crowd ) <---------------> lone wolf cave man in the wood

stupid ----- smart ------------ stupid



.
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lonewolf
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Re: Not going anywhere

Post by lonewolf » February 5th, 2019, 4:08 pm

LoneAlpha14 wrote:
February 5th, 2019, 7:26 am
@lonewolf, again, if you reject positive and negative attitudes, why have you chosen such a negative one? You opted for it! You are just doing what most of the people are - curling up close to the darkness. I am sorry, it's not that I cannot replicate some of the things you said, because I also felt and thought more or less similarly at some point, and I have this natural ability to grasp and understand people objectively, but refusing to change one's opinion and attitude due to some preconceived conceptions won't get us anywhere. Why do you think being positive means escaping reality? Why would a mission imply predestination, and so what if it does? What's so bad about predestination if you still are yet to discover it? What's preset there in your mind? Maybe in some outer universe, but here? Nothing. And, sometimes, life's more about our path on our mission (if I need to use the word), rather than the "mission" itself. And that path is untamed, unexplored, and full of mystery.

My questions were referring to what you first said - I wanted to know whether you've even tried to discover more; you said you did, and nothing fulfilled you. It's okay, it happens - I know. But, you just need to keep moving! What makes you feel alive? What awakens even a bit of emotions within yourself? What did you thought your special gift? What happened that made you start feel there's nothing life has in store for you? What made you change your attitude? If it's just out of pure realization, you belong back in the era of romanticism. You know why? Because they were mostly the ones to cry over their poor destinies. About a life of unexperienced, unmet emotions, adventures, and all the rest. Once again, sorry for my being so blunt and brutal, but I think it's too bad for a potential talent to rot in such a whirlwind of demons created by the very same person. I know it's daunting, because I am still managing on getting out myself. But I made so much progress totally on my own, that I want to convince others they are the ones to design their life, and make choices that would impact their being. Not the society. Screw the society. You don't have to belong to be able to live, progress, and contribute. Or whatever. I guess I should stop, because, after all, you don't know my story, and I don't know yours. But, let's keep it here, since it is a community of us, who came to understand and discover, and, hopefully, eventually help and improve. Simply, learn, realize, and progress.. Too many verbs, pick yours. :)
I don't know what makes you think that I chose a "negative" one. I'm just being realistic and working based on what life has taught me about myself and what I can do.

Being positive means thinking all the things that happen can be of positive value to our lives.
Being negative means thinking all the things that happen can be of negative value to our lives.
I chose not to follow any of these, and rather see the real value of each thing in my life based on my empirical experience with them.

I don't believe in predestination, period. There's no discussion here, unless there's some empirical proof of that.
I have no mission and no path. I can't have a yearning for the goal, nor enjoy the journey.

I'm trying to discover more every day. I'm moving, but when you don't know where you want to go, all the paths are the wrong one.

Nothing makes me feel alive. Nothing awakens even a bit of emotion within myself. I don't even know how it feels like to feel that.

I thought that my supposed "intelligence" would take me somewhere, but this isn't happened, and I think I'm not intelligent at all.

I feel like I have nothing to do, no place to go, no one to talk with, no projects, no dreams, no goals. It happened with the course of my life. I'm not a romantic.

You could be as blunt as you wish here.

I don't believe in "potential". I don't have any potential talent. What matters is what the person is able to do and gets done.

I can't design my life or make choices because I have no "I" to guide me at all.

Learn or realize means no progress for me because I'm not going anywhere.

I want to get out of this, but I don't believe this is possible.
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lonewolf
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Re: Not going anywhere

Post by lonewolf » February 5th, 2019, 4:12 pm

GMSI7D wrote:
February 5th, 2019, 10:43 am
on this forum, people are " lone wolves " and things like that.

this is ok for a while because society is stupid as Bob Fischer ( chess world champion ) said

but on the long term, you have to think above that.


the point is not to be the caveman in the woods but a leader of men above the stupid crowd


so it looks like this on the balance :


stupid crowd < ----------> you here leading a small group of men ( not the stupid crowd ) <---------------> lone wolf cave man in the wood

stupid ----- smart ------------ stupid

I can't be a leader of men because first I need to be a leader of myself.

I have no internal compass to guide me. I can't lead anything if I still can't lead myself.

Due to my personality and nature, I envision myself as a "leader", but in real life I see that I'm not even leading myself, so, I'm way behing in my development to even think about leadership.

Bottom line, I'm an INTJ without a vision or goal. I need this first. Or I'll be wasted.
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GMSI7D
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Re: Not going anywhere

Post by GMSI7D » February 12th, 2019, 2:36 pm

being a lone wolf does not mean being a lone owl in the forest

it means flying with the eagles in the moutains , not the dumb birds of the street .

people here have trouble understanding this. they have a lot of work in order to emerge above society's stupidity


a lot of work.


they either say " we have to be social with the dumb birds " or " we have to be lone owls "

this is absurd in either case

if you look at he mbti theory, here are some statistics

sensing people = 76 % of the population

intuitive people = 24 %


sensing people are the pawns of the chessboard called " society "

rational people are the main pieces

INTJ are queen and ENTJ are kings ( or vice versa but you get the point )


wich means they fly with the eagles


slap your face, do whatever it takes but try to understand this . at least once in your life.


i am already fed up with the stupid crowd. this is enough .


.
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